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The Old Charger

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Category: General Chat
Forum Name: Your Bike
Forum Description: We are all proud of our steeds so post a Pic. The more exotic the bike or location the better.
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Printed Date: 28 Mar 2024 at 15:17
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Topic: The Old Charger
Posted By: arlurt
Subject: The Old Charger
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 11:05
Thought I'd better figure out how to post photos and share a couple of my bike as it was when I bought it for myself for Christmas.

 

 

 
It's a 2002 RSV Mille R 37,000 miles, in need of a little love and care.

The plan is to fix what's wrong with it, known jobs so far include:

Worn Titanium Nitride coating on the forks, fork bushes, and leaky seals
Dodgy headstock bearings
Worn front brake rotors
Sticking rear brake calliper and knackered rear disk
Loads of other minor issues

Tidy up the cosmetics:

Poor lacquer on all the carbon bits
Missing, dodgy and wrong decals
Rusty fasteners
Repaint components that have suffered neglect
Torn Seat
Cracked Screen

Make some of the improvements that are so popular on here:

Modded exhaust collector
FR200 Chip
Open Exhaust
Large Intake Boot, and maybe the Airbox Mod

The jobs are under-way, the whole front end is off the bike, fork tubes and sliders with a local specialist for re-coating the Ti-Ni and new bushes.  The clip-ons and yokes have  been stripped and repainted.  New (taper roller) headstock bearings fitted with a spacer here and there to stop the seals dragging on the roller cages, and a new top dust seal.  Brake and clutch master cylinders are stripped, should go back together later today once I stop messin' about on the computer!

 

I've re-lacquered the front mudguard, side air ducts and instrument glare shield, much improved. And I've had a go at making my own decals for the side air-ducts.  The colour's not a great match but I think they're better than not being there, and total cost was only £3 on coloured vinyl and some of my time.


I'm spending a fair amount of time on eBay, looking for the parts I need.  The postman has brought me a pair of Brembo rotors, a rear disk, a new front brake reservoir, an exhaust collector to send to Redratbike for "Modding", an FR200 chip, and an early Aprilia Racing Evo Titanium exhaust. There have been countless little bags of fasteners, and paint, and bearings, and seals.  So most days I come home to a nice surprise of some sort or other.

Of course I wanted an Akrapovic exhaust but after several weeks looking I haven't found one at a price I can justify, so I'm hoping the Titanium Evo will do the job.  I've seen several people on here say they're very loud, maybe I'll have to experiment with baffles for normal pottering about.

I'm here to draw on other's experience too, which has helped me decide what I want to do with the bike.  I've seen some talk about a larger airbox boot as a useflu mod?  I might have one already, what do the large and small versions look like?

Anyway, better go and do something useful.

Thanks for your help.





Replies:
Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 11:21
The forum I spent a lot of time on years ago used to allow you to embed images by putting img before a link, and /img after, so that the actual image appeared, rather then a link.  Is this not possible any more?

One of the users mentioned "Premium Membership" , what would that do for me if it's available?

Thanks.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 11:29
And I always spot the typo's after I've posted, are we allowed to edit our posts to the mistakes later?  Embarrassed


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 12:36
Hi arlut, I'm not far from you in Bedale and working at Linton-on-Ouse.
Looks like you're heading in the right direction with your bike Thumbs Up 
Look here at post #3 for larger air boot:
https://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/showthread.php?58808-Tuono-air-box
I've got premium membership...you get access to another part of the forum (which is rarely used these days tbh, but includes being able to download service manuals) and being able to upload photos using the forum server. To be honest most people on here pay the fiver a year to show support for AP as much as anything.
The main thing about the forum is the amount of knowledge freely available from participating members.  



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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 13:54
Hi Stevex,

Thanks for your reply.

The http://www.Apriliaforum.com" rel="nofollow - www.Apriliaforum.com seems to be off line, might that be temporary or a problem at my end?

I've just opened the ECU to fit my FR200 chip to find it's already got an after-market EPROM in there. The fitted EPROM is marked "SCUBA EB42" and "GRT".  Anyone know anything about it?



When I took the standard exhaust off the bike I did notice it was held on with "MIVV" springs so thought maybe it had a can on it at some time.  It's also had an open air-box conversion, but just the alloy rim, and a taller K&N filter.  The rubber seal was missing.

I knew the airbox job wasn't right as the alloy rim on the top of the airbox didn't fit against the underside of the petrol tank, no where near a seal, and riding the bike home when I bought it there was a strong smell from the engine breather that was finding it's way out somewhere.  Having done a bit of research, it seems there should've been a floppy rubber seal sandwiched between the alloy ring and the tope edge of the lower airbox half, but this is just missing.  For the moment I'll run the standard airbox with the K&N that fits inside.  Unless someone can advise otherwise?


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 15:32
GRT is Gabro who can be found on AF1's site.
He's the main supplier of chips for our bikes, together with Forza's FR100 & 200.
He does seem to do custom mapped chips, so I'm guessing the PO of your bike has talked to him prior to being supplied with the chip you have fitted; it may be mapped for an open air box.
Although I have the big air boot, FR200, modded collector and straight through pipe, I've stayed with the OEM air box and just replaced the K&N with an OEM air filter. 
From what I've seen on this forum, open air boxes do have the rubber seal you're talking about. If the K&N was fitted as per standard at the air inlet, the lack of a seal may be letting in contaminants, so probably good job you've re installed the air box. If you post up pics of your set up, someone with better info than me will advise you.
btw, I've no probs connecting to AF1 with your link.
bbtw, try 'Image-works' for decals, they do loads of Aprilia stuff, are very good and quite cheap.


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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: colinmeadows
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 16:02
that gabro chip as a top chip message gabro on facebook for its spec. as for your airbox seal it sounds like you are missing the seal have a look on aprilia performance site at the top of the page and you can see what you should have !!


Posted By: colinmeadows
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 16:10
see this for the large air boot  http://www.rsvr.net/gen-1-airbox_topic26069.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.rsvr.net/gen-1-airbox_topic26069.html


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 16:44
Thanks everyone.

Interesting about the Gabro chip that's fitted, I'll contact him to see what it is.

I've had a frustrating afternoon, trying to get the fuel tank to fit properly, do they distort with age?  It's as far back as it will go on the rear mount, and still almost touching the top yoke at the front.  On full lock the inner ends (where they go round the fork leg) of the clip ons touch the tank, and the front of the tank is sat on the headstock bearing dust seal.  I took the rear under-tray out as the back of the tank seemed to be up against the battery box, but that hasn't made much difference.

As an easy job, I thought I'd take the hugger off to clean it up and re-lacquer, but I had to use a chisel and mole grips to get three of the bolts out, and the fourth just sheared!  The hugger is OK, no damage, three bolt holes will clean up fine, the sheared one will take a bit of work.

I've had enough for today, time for an early doors beer or two.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 16:55
Looking through the MoTs, the bike was doing the usual two or three thousand miles each year, then in 2014/15 it did 11,000 miles.  I guess it was daily transport for a while , and that's probable what's made it show it's age.


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 18:26
The plastic tanks do swell as the nylon absorbs water drawn in by the ethanol in the petrol. 
One solution is to drain the tank, remove the pump and put the tank somewhere warm for a couple of months to let the water evaporate. The tank will then revert to its normal size!
I find it easier to fit the front two mounting bolts first, then try to get the rear ones in.


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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 19:54
Thanks again Stevex.

I haven't had to consider a variable geometry petrol tank before, they've generally been steel.  It was a question in hope that the frame wasn't bent, thinking that was why it didn't seem to fit properly.

I'l bolt the front down and crowbar the back in to place, though the rubbers on the front mount are always going to allow it to shuffle forward a bit.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 09:46
It seems the large airbox boot isn't available as a new part anymore, don't suppose anyone has a spare one they'd like to sell...?
 
Gabro got back to me, simply said the SCUBA EB42 chip I have is for an RSV with an "After-Market Can".  I guess that makes sense if the bike had a "MIVV" exhaust as the springs suggest, but not with my OEM standard exhaust.  I'll keep the GRT chip safe and stick with the new FR200 chip, which with the modded collector, Aprilia Racing Can, K&N and Airbox changes should be a better matched set.
 
I've joined up as a "Premium" user, hoping it'll make using photos easier, and it's be nice if I could edit out my typos...?


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 11:20
Good news, I've found a large airbox boot, bought and paid for. All the places I tried for a new item suggest that they're no longer available. 
 
They're a tricky item to find on eBay at the right price.  Anyone listing just the boot, generally knows what they've got, and charges appropriately.
 
So you go hunting for the parts where the seller thinks it's just another bit of old motorbike to sell, and they're described in all sorts of different ways, as boots, ducts and rubber pipes.
 
My "Top Tip" for the day,  look for airboxes with the right rubber boot attached...  Wink


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 08:45
Playing with the RSV in the workshop last night, while it's pretty much naked of plastics I started to work my way through the wiring looking for issues.  When I bought the bike, there was an obvious look of relief on the face of the seller when it started so that I could take it away.  It's failed to start at first attempt a few times since I bought it, but always stared eventually.
 
I've seen that there are battery upgrades, Starter cable upgrades, Reg/Rec Mods and all sorts mentioned on the forums, but the general view seems to be that the bike is borderline on the starting and electrical system.  It'll be fine so long as everything is good order....?
 
I've found corrosion on the connections to the starter solenoid, starter motor and in the reg/rec connector blocks.  The battery is run-of-the-mill, but recently new so I'll hang on to it for the moment.  I was looking at remaking the battery and starter cable terminations, and replacing the rotten rubber boots but have now decided that a new set of battery/starter cables is the right way to go, thanks Johnboy for your help.
 
I've seen somewhere that owners are removing the connector blocks between the reg/rec and the loom and soldering the units in, is this really the best solution or can I get away with cleaning up the terminals and tightening the crimps?
 
Another thing I found is a large diode in the loom to the left clip-on switch gear. The diode is a DIY replacement, I assume for an OE item that was there before, what does it do?  I've cleaned it up, heat-shink sleeved it and remade the sleeving on that loom.
 
I need the bike to be reliable, or as reliable as an Italian bike can be.  I plan on going away on it for a week in June, and don't want to be the butt of all the jokes if it decides to embarrass me.
 
While I'm in electrical mode, is there anything else I should be looking at?  Confused


Posted By: twinfan
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 13:31
While you a doing (johnboys) cables,  an upgraded starter solenoid will help 150Amp  AP do them

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on my licence it says "tear down the dotted line" so I DO!


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 13:53
I've seen others talking about the 150A starter solenoid upgrade.
 
 
How does it differ from what's on the bike as standard?  I can't see any markings on the one that's fitted, is there any way to tell if I've already got one...?


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 17:10
Two more bits of carbon re-lacquered and nicely dried in the kitchen while she's away... Wink





The front mudguard is fighting me all the way.  I think silicone polish has got in to the carbon weave and is causing pin-holes in the lacquer.  Third attempt at it tonight, I think I'll just have to live with it.  The red Aprilia sticker is fine by the way, the camera flash just washes the colour out.




Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 17:51
The diode could be a mod done by the PO to allow high and low beams to come on together.
Info here from post #20 onwards:

http://apriliarsv.com/guides/5102-dipped-beam-wiring-mod-old-new-switch-types.html" rel="nofollow - http://apriliarsv.com/guides/5102-dipped-beam-wiring-mod-old-new-switch-types.html

Yep, large air boots are relatively rare now and the going rate is about £50.
Some people have removed the cylindrical white connector in the V and the brown connector at the voltage regulator due to poor crimp mating which generate heat and can burn the connectors out. I've still got mine fitted and they are in good condition, I'm guessing the PO has ensured they're a tight fit at the terminals.
I've actually just bought a Fireblade voltage regulator (FH014AA) to replace the Aprilia original, as being a MOSFET it generates a lot less heat and is more reliable. As part of this mod I'll remove the brown connector. Beware there are loads of copies of the Shindengen rr's out there, which is why I bought used from a known bike.
Great info here:

https://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/showthread.php?211850-Voltage-Rectifier-Regulator-upgrade-(Honda-Yamaha-rectifiers)

The original starter solenoid is not up to the job of supplying enough current to the starter motor, the 150A upgrade will sort it, but again beware, lots of chinese rip off copies out there. With Johnboy's cable kit you'll notice a big difference.
Be aware poor starting can knacker the sprag clutch, so make it a priority to put right.


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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: greenman1966
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 18:17
AF1 sell the large airboot.
And for a lot less than people want 2nd hand.
They also have the gen 1coolant bottles, again cheaper than 2nd hand.
 
Dennis in NZ


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 18:51
Thanks both.

I'll strip the Reg Rec connectors and see what the crimps are like.  There's quite a bit of corrosion on a couple of the spade connectors, so I'll clean that off for a start and nip up the female spades.  If it's all dodgy I can get some new crimps, or solder it up.

I've bought a complete Falco airbox which shows a large airbox boot in the photos.  I've paid £30 for it, including shipping,, and though it looks pretty mucky I'm hoping it will be serviceable.  Assuming they're interchangeable, which they look to be, I'll fit the boot and look at cutting up the airbox top to make an open airbox as I've seen in one of the posts on here.  I'd rather go that way than the alloy plate and floppy rubber seal  idea that the bike should've had when I bought it.


Posted By: spiceweasel
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 19:13
Arn't the air  inlets on the rsv round & the falco oval?

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www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk


Posted By: aaressveeguy
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 19:16
how do you relaquer carbon? My cf huggers are starting to show their age. ..


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 19:30
Originally posted by aaressveeguy aaressveeguy wrote:

how do you relaquer carbon? My cf huggers are starting to show their age. ..

I sanded mine with wet and dry, making sure you end up with a smooth finish, then de grease and lacquer. Don't try to remove the old lacquer, you just need to ensure the surface is smooth.
Do it right and it'll look like new.


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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 19:32
I don't know spiceweasel, the pictures on the listing aren't great, I'll see when it arrives.  Maybe I'll have some work to do, but even oval they won't be as restrictive as the boot I have.

For re-lacquering the carbon bits I've just given them a good thorough clean in hot water with strong detergent, very brief wipe over with a solvent rag, and flatted then back with wet'n'dry.  Then two or three coats of rattle-can lacquer.

The carbon bits were really dull, particularly the hugger and front mudguard, I guess they get the worst of it.  You wouldn't have thought they were the proper stuff until you had them off the bike and found how light and rigid they are.



Posted By: legend88
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 21:04
Nice job on the hugger. Some of the OE carbon fibre has pin holes in it and people have reported problems when trying to re lacquer.

Sadly you will find the Falco airboot to be different. As said the inlets are oval and will not line up with the air duct holes in frame.




Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 00:11
Thanks Legend88, I'll post a picture or two of the Falco bits when I get them.

Still might not be a total loss, this is the picture from the listing...




Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 11:56
The sheared hugger fastener has been dealt with, another unexpected hour wasted.



It can't be a coincidence that the battery box drain is above the fastener that sheared.  Quite a bit of corrosion in that area, maybe just a mix of water, salt, heat and dis-similar metals...


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 14 Mar 2019 at 18:26
My Ti Can has arrived!  It was a bit grubby, a couple of scuffs on the stainless steel bands at each end, but basically straight.  I've spent a bit of time with a flap-wheel in the Dremel, then a fine wire brush and the scuffs are much better.  Then it got a rub with a pan scourer and some Jiff and I'm almost happy with it.  It'll get a final polish up when I get it on the bike, should be good enough.







Now, if I can just get the bike back together I can see if it's really as loud as everyone says it is!!  Confused



Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2019 at 09:00
Has anyone got any experience of re-packing exhausts?  If I hold the can vertically, and then turning it upside down, end to end, I can hear something fairly heavy sliding up and down inside.  I'm guessing that the packing material has shrunk and is now free to move about inside the can.  I'll pop one end off and see what's happening inside...


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2019 at 10:01
Depend on the outlet size, the smaller is loud, the larger is LOUD LOL





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www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2019 at 11:19
Thanks IanG, that's another vote on the LOUD side.  Embarrassed
 
Maybe my re-pack will quieten things down a bit... 


Posted By: snowman
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2019 at 12:44
Full Akro , baffles out and I still think it’s quiet on mine?


Posted By: constant
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2019 at 14:14
i got the big outlet one i cant hear how loud it is cos the induction from the open air box so loud i did wonder if you can get these repacked though let us know how you get on


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2019 at 16:20
Hi Constant, pleased to hear there's not just me using one of the LOUD cans, though how long I will be able to hear seems to be a matter of debate.  Big smile

I've ordered a repack kit off t'internet, and I'll pull the end off the can over the weekend unless I get sidetracked.  It sounds like the wadding in my can is pretty dense, and sliding up and down in the can. That can't be right...

The Falco Airbox, Filter and Boot were on the doorstep when I got home today.  Yeah the inlets are oval, but the whole thing is a lot less restrictive than the 2002 model RSV one that's on the bike at the moment.  I'll fasten it to the RSV airbox and see what sits where.



There was an eMail when I got home too, the fork legs were ready.   So straight back out again and picked them up.  They've had the old, worn, Titanium Nitride coating removed and re-done, new slider bushes, new oil seals and new dust seals.  I've just got to put them back together now.  Oh, and new Ohlins stickers too, the important bit!



The guy did them told me the coating fails partly because the slide bushes wear, resulting in point loading on the coating instead of the load being spread over a larger area.  Makes sense, let's see how they do.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2019 at 22:34
Fork legs back together, with roughly the right amount of oil in 'em.  All the damping adjustments seem to work, and pre-load adjuster moving OK.  It's nice to be putting stuff back together for a change, stereo on, an a beer on the go.  Smile 



Hope to have them back in the yokes tomorrow, and maybe a wheel back in too.


Posted By: badapple
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 02:12
Hello and welcome along. Somehow missed this thread. Very impressive work you're carrying out your bike looked pretty tidy from the original posts but she'll be a minter by the time you've finished. You'll fit right in with us OCD members with that level of detail Thumbs Up

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I started out with nothing and I've still got most of it left


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 09:01
Thanks badapple.

As I'm sure we all know, photos flatter a bike.  Mine's well used, and is very unlikely to ever be what it was when it was new.  I want it to look tidy (for it's age!) and to be useable.  If I can't rely on it then I've failed.

I like the attitude on here, about tweaking, modifying and improving your bikes, and the way everyone shares what they learn.

I hope I'm adding something, even if I'm only helping others learn from my mistakes.  Like the Falco boot!  I will make something of it...


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 13:25
Tip for the lower part of the air boot :    if you want a good seal against the frame rails without the ape bodge of a sticky foam ring then cut the ends off the origin later boot and trim the cut ends to fit into the flared ends of the old style unit.

It all fits together well and if you fit Edwards tubes as well the airflow is completely isolated from the hot chassis rails. Wink


-------------
www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 13:59
Thanks IanG, that's a good use for the redundant Old Inlet Rubbers and might help make the ovals a little more round.

So I'm hoping that parts are going to start getting refitted, every time I've been in the workshop over the last few weeks I seem to have taken yet another bit off the bike. It's pretty sad at the moment.



I've spent some of the morning cleaning up the Falco parts to see what's useful. I'm surprised to find the Falco Airbox has a larger volume than the RSV.  The top is higher at the front, and the lower has slightly move volume on the right side.  I'm even more surprised to find that the Falco Airbox fits under the RSV tank.   The Falco item also uses the larger air filter, the same one that was with my Open Airbox Kit.  I wasn't happy with the open airbox idea, so I'll fit the Falco airbox.





The Falco Boot does have oval holes but they're several times the size of those in the standard RSV Boot I have.




These oval holes don't quite line up with the holes in the frame rails, but they're are significantly bigger that the holes in the frame.  



IanG's suggestion might help the fairly soft oval opening in the boot line up with the round openings in the frame.  I'll have a go...

I had to go to the Post Office this morning, more new bits arriving.  I've got Redratbike's modded collector, and the exhaust re-pack wadding for the Aprilia Racing Ti Can has come.



It's getting to the point where I've got to put some bits on the bike as I'm running out of space to stash them.  There's still most of the weekend to Go, I'd like to get Johnboy's cables fitted, it seems sensible to do the exhaust before I put the front end back in, and I'd like to get the airbox back on once and for all.  




Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 14:06
Yes those do look bigger than the mille ports, it was a bit of a tight fit what I did but those openings may be too big.

Nice find on the airbox proper Clap
 

-------------
www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 18:05
It Lives...!



Modded collector fitted, New Battery and Starter cables in, and the Ti Exhaust lashed up just see how loud it is before I re-pack it.



Wow!!  It sounds fantastic, hard to believe it's the same bike with just a few tweaks.

The starter spins over loads better, excellent job Johnboy, thanks.

I'll post a few more pictures later, of the of the Falco Airbox fit, and the battle with the starter motor...




Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 21:32
Once my ears stopped ringing, I took the Ti Can off the bike and stripped it down.  It's only 14 pop-rivets to drill out and a tap with the rubber hammer to get things moving.  Here's what was moving about inside...



It seems to be a pad of steel wool, with a couple of pieces of rockwool insulation amongst it.  Nasty.

I cleaned up the perforated core tube, and tidied up the stainless steel bands ready to put it back together.



Then I've wrapped my new wadding round the perforated tube, an off-cut above and below the tube as a nod towards the pipe being oval, and slid the outer tube over the whole lot.  It took all of the wadding, a piece 450x1000mm.

I've run the bike again, and it sounds exactly the same to me.  Ah well, it obviously needed doing, can't have it spitting shreds of steel wool out the back, but I did think it would make some difference, to tone if not volume.  I might have to experiment with a baffle pipe for when I'm just pottering around.

Still sounds Fantastic, it might be OK when I get it outside, they always sound much louder if you run them in the garage.  Wink


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 21:36
Running the new battery and starter cables revealed a couple of things.  Firstly, how thin the standard cables are, particularly the Earth connections from Battery to Frame Earth, and Frame Earth to Engine. The second thing I found was the awful corroded condition of the Starter Motor connection.  The perished rubber boot was in place but I think it was holding water in rather than  keeping it out.



I had to take the starter off the bike to cut the terminal nut off and clean up the threads.  Fortunately it all cleaned up OK, and as I said earlier, works MUCH better.



I also cleaned up the surface of the alloy pads that the starter bolts pass through. These need to be clean too as they're the earth connection for the starter.  I've applied Johnboy's silicone grease to the connections to try to keep the water out as advised.

The Engine Earth bolt was awkward to slacken off, it's not a big socket head bolt, M6, and there isn't straight line access to it from outside the frame rail.  I took the coolant bottle off and used an extension with a wobble joint and a hex bit in the end to get to it.  I've replaced the socket screw with a normal bolt, easier to get some torque on to it.

The Frame Earth, inside the right frame rail, was best accessed with a long extension from the left side of the bike.  It was pretty clean so no problems there.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2019 at 21:57
The Falco Airbox seems to work OK.  Though it's taller than the RSV unit, with a slightly different shape to the lower section, it fits without modification, and somehow fits under the tank as well.



I didn't like the "Open Airbox" idea, this has a bit bigger capacity than the RSV unit, is properly sealed, and takes the taller filter used by the Open Airbox Kit.  I thought the stacks might be different for the Falco, but they measure up the same as the RSV items.

For the moment I'm not going to try to seal the Airbox Rubber Boot to the inside of the frame rails, and I won't try to reshape the oval openings to round.  The whole thing is much less restrictive than the old RSV boot, and when the bike's moving there should be enough cold air coming in the ducts to stop the engine drawing hot air from under the tank.  Unless you guys know different...?

Which reminds me.... The stick-on heat shield on the underside of the petrol tank has fallen off.  One of the POs had stitch it on with double sided tape that hasn't done well under there.  Do I need it?  and If I do, has anyone found a good way to stick it on?


Posted By: Fitz
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 09:52
Hi Arlurt, am fairly local to you in Harrogate, bike looks well 
Quick question who did you send your forks to for the refurb ? 


Posted By: Mr Miller
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 11:15
Enjoying yer thread me auld mucker.. these were made never to see a drop of rain
and one would have to think the makers did`nt know about different metal sydrom Confused
I did my electrics pre knowing about John Boy .. used welding power flex from solenoid
to starter (lectrickery likes lots of strands to run up and down) made a hell of a difference
not one fail to start since. Military wrapped the wires at the brown connectors
(mine were in a hell of a state) and it`s been happy days on the firing up front since
now I just need to find the skill to stay on the chuffin thing Ouch
Keep up the good work .. look forward to the next episode..


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If you find us in a hedge check the bike first please .. I`m free on the NHS...


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 11:59
Thanks Mr Miller and Fitz.  I'm happy with progress, no disasters so far!

Fitz, the forks were done by Gareth at Reactive Suspension between York and Sutton on Forest, he has an Industrial Unit.  It's a very professional set up, two Suspension Dynos, Data Logging, and he's developed his own modifications.  Seems to do a lot with racers, and runs suspension training courses.

I took the stripped fork legs to him, tubes and sliders.  While we talked about what was needed he stripped them further to there component parts using special tools in just a few minutes.

The tubes were sent away to have the old coating stripped and new applied.  He's replaced the slider bushes, hydraulic seals and dust seals.

I'm not sure I'm allowed to promote businesses, but I'm sure you can find him on Google...

More progress this morning.  Front end back in, pin-hole-lacquered mudguard on, air ducts on, and lots of head scratching with cable routing.  



I think I've got the cable routing right, but might have to spend a little time with the Workshop manual to reassure myself.


Posted By: spiceweasel
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 12:20
👍👍 for Gareth at reactive he sorted my setup on the falco when I bought it as it was like riding an ironing board.

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www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 19:07
It doesn't seem fair that the little pieces take as long as the big ones to sort out.  I've spent most of the afternoon stripping the slightly dodgy pattern Clutch Lever, clearing all the dead grease, and getting the rust off the seized steel parts.



I had planned to buy a new Brembo Clutch lever, then I found out how much they cost!  It's back together, all nicely greased.  The hydraulic seals are OK, but the dust boot was knackered.  At least the boot was available as an Aprilia part, but it's seven quid...!  Same part as the Front Brake dust boot.

Clutch slave cylinder tomorrow.  Progress might be a little slower from now on, my wife has been away with the girls from work for a week in the sun but she's back tonight, and might expect to enjoy my company without having to sit with me and the RSV in the workshop.  Fingers crossed she gets bored of my conversation so I have another week or two to finish the RSV!  Wink


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 19:23
Undertray back in tonight, and more cable routing.  It's still very tight from the front of the battery box to the back of the petrol tank, I might have to hack the front out of the battery box to gain 5mm.

I ran the bike until the fans kicked in, mainly to check the fans work, and to see that the charging system is doing what it's meant to.  It's showing 14.2v on the dash, and though I have seen threads saying not to trust the dash volt meter, it's right where I'd expect it to be.

Having run it for a while, I think it might be slightly quieter than it was before I re-packed the exhaust, and running it with the workshop door open I don't think it's too loud.  It's no louder than than my XB12R Buell was, that had a similarly radical exhaust, and passed MoTs... Wink

There was some unexpected good news too... Having got the bike running, and set the clocks up properly, it says it's done 28,000 miles, not the 37,000 I thought.  Maybe I need to change the subject of this thread to "Not Quite So Old Charger"?

Didn't get round to the clutch slave cylinder, but I'm sure it'll still be there when I come back to it.


Posted By: Johnlawton
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2019 at 08:42
When I set about the second coming of an RSV1000r 2002 which has been sitting still for 10 years in someone’s garden, after around 10 hours labour I popped the new battery on and the bike had done 8400 miles, these bikes are amazing and constantly reward you, I’ve got a few bikes like S1000rr but to be honest, the power and culture these Apes have are perfect for the road, when I purchased the bike, in the dirt and leaves was a set of Renegade race pipes, I couldn’t believe my luck! And a private number plate, I love this bike!


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2019 at 10:22
Hi Johnlawton,
 
I'm certainly pleased with the RSV, but it's the little things that frustrate.  Use of cheap fasteners that suffer in the UK climate, made worse by our use of road salt, and worse still by neglect.  It wouldn't add much to the cost of a bike to use decent fasteners.  And the cheap/nasty Italian electrical connectors are almost as bad as the Jap stuff from the 70s.
 
The RSV is a bit on the large side for me, for a light bike it's surprisingly bulky.  It's got four crash bungs on the frame, they look 'orrible, and rear ones bash your shins if I try to paddle the bike about.  I'll ditch the rear bungs, but of course to get rid of the rear frame crash bungs I've got to find a pair of standard engine bolts...
 
The crash bungs on the front wheel are already gone.  What's the point making the front end out of super-light exotic materials and then nailing a pound of nylon and steel to the front axle!?
 
The slightly high seat, and on my toes issues, are made worse by the fact that I'm a man in his 50s's who likes his food and likes a pint!  The back end of the petrol tank isn't very forgiving for those of us with a generous frame.  No doubt about it, I need to loose a few pounds to fit the bike better, but I managed OK on the Buell XB12R, and the Brutale isn't exactly a cruiser-style riding position.
 
I haven't ridden the RSV since before New Year, when I popped out for petrol on a dry day.  It has/had a worrying low-speed weave at around 40mph. which I hope I've fixed.  The (taper) headstock bearings were marked with an uneven wear pattern, and the steering damper rose-joints were rusted and loose.  If it still does it when I've finished, then I can try replacing tyres, but I do hope that what I've done has cured it.
 
I'm looking forward to getting the bike back together and useable.  The mods described on this forum are exactly the sort of stuff I'm interested in, reliability, better starting, smooth mid-range power delivery, and noise!
 
I really liked my Buell, having something different has always appealed, and I liked the big-twin power delivery.
 
 
For a while I've been trying to set myself up with bikes that are different, and don't cost me money to own while they're just sat in the garage.  I've got a 70s Kawasaki and an 80s Yamaha which are holding their value nicely, and the Buell did the same.  I traded it in for more than I paid for it, even after several years of happy riding.  Having sold it, prices seem to have gone up even more, but I've had one, and enjoyed it.
 
I've missed having a big-twin, I'm not rich (or stylish) enough to be a Ducati man, and hadn't really been looking to buy another bike until a friend at work told me he was thinking of breaking his RSV-R because it was worth more in bits than as a whole.  It's like someone coming up to you in the pub, carrying a sack, and telling you he's going to drown these puppies, unless you want them...?
 
So now I'm an RSV owner.  I hope I haven't overpaid, particularly as I've spent nearly half as much again repairing and "improving" it.  It fits nicely with my other unusual bikes, and will hopefully hold its value and be good to ride.  It's not a fixer-upper, I'm going right through it with the intention of it being with me for a while.  Until the RSV arrived I didn't have a sports-bike, a bike with a fairing, or a big-twin, and now I have all of these in one.


Posted By: Johnlawton
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2019 at 20:11
Thanks for the message, for me the RSV is all about the midrange, the ride is tall but once you get used to using the grunt in the midrange you’ll be smiling all the time your riding, I agree with the cheap fixings, but that’s Italians for you, they intend to bolt on instead of manufacturing there own components, or investing in better quality, but, what you do get is great handling and stand out stand alone soul of a bike, for me these bikes are great value, I’ve had everything from Ducati’s to Gixers, ZX10r, S1000rr, R1, KTM’s, they all have power and in some cases amazing quality, but I still think the RSV1000r has something a little different, takes me back to when 1000cc bikes felt big and a handful. 


Posted By: spiceweasel
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2019 at 22:31
+1 on the grunt, my mate on his k3 gsxr 100 says there's nowt in it up to 130 on a straight run then his revs build but I'm at next corner by then,the torque delivery is supreme & very often surprises people,twins are best for the road 👍

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www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 11:03
Short of time, I tried and failed, to remove the clutch slave cylinder last night...  Embarrassed
 
Now that I've had a look in the Workshop Manual I know the lower clutch slave fastener is cunningly hidden behind the rubber doorstop on the end of the fairing support post.  Ah, those cunning Italians.
 
There seems to be something missing from the top of the clutch cylinder spacer, there a shiny threaded hole where it looks like a PO has removed something.  Anyone know what's missing, or have a photo of the upper side of your clutch slave cylinder?


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 17:46
Low speed tram lining...had it with my Tuono and tracked it down to the Ohlins steering damper, one of which I guess you have fitted. Pull the piston in and out; if it's really hard to get moving then gets easier once it is moving, the bushes have dried out. The cure is a service, which isn't cheap. I decided not to invest £100+ on the service and re fitted the OEM damper, problem solved.

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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 20:08
Hi Stevex,

Those are exactly the symptoms, and I have noticed that the steering damper is difficult to get moving when it's been sat for a while.  It's been on the bench a little while, you pick it up, and it won't move until you really lean on it!  Thanks.

The shiny tapped hole behind the clutch slave cylinder was an M6 nut lost by a previous owner that's found its way in to the notch at the back of the clutch slave cylinder.  More good news, nothing missing.

I see lots of people changing to after-market clutch slave cylinders, what's the problem with the OEM unit?  I've stripped and cleaned everything, adjusted the clutch lever push rod, bled the system and all seems to be working well...  



Do I need to brace myself for a failure? Will I get any warning...?

Oh.and another thing...  This was lodged on top of the engine cases, obviously a drain pipe from somewhere, rotted off whatever alloy part it was fastened to.



Any ideas anyone...?  Confused


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 20:34
The part in the picture I'm sure is from the bottom of the fuel tank where the water drains connect.
The aluminium part is actually part of the tank. Look at the bottom rear area of your tank, there are 2 drain pipes...that's one of them.
They do block up, so I'm guessing yours did and the water caused the corrosion.
I've got an Oberon clutch slave fitted; you can also get MPL ones. They both have different sized pistons fitted than standard and so make the force required to pull the clutch lever in, less. OEM slaves are known to leak, but can be re sealed., so can the after market ones. It's the reduced lever pull required that is why most people change them.


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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: redratbike
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 20:56
The original clutch is rather heavy

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www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 21:22
Thanks everyone, that makes sense, the clutch is a bit heavy by modern standards.  I'll give it a go as is and see how I get on, maybe I need to get some grip exercisers for when I'm sat in front of the telly?  Wink  Or riding the bike and using the clutch to exercise my left hand might work!

Other job tonight was routing cables for the starter solenoid and battery.



They're in, but I'm not happy with the routing to the starter solenoid.  I'll have another look tomorrow, it might be better to route the cables past the solenoid and come back at it from the other direction. 


Posted By: 426hemi
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 22:35
The pipe looks like a drain pipe off the bottom of the tank.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 07:25
Thanks 426hemi, I'll try to have a look at the underside of the tank and see if I can spot where it's come from.  It's been suggested that it's the overflow/water drain from the petrol tank filler neck, that they block up, and then rot off as mine appears to have done.
 
 
The area of the tank around the filler is a bit mucky, as though water has been stood there, and I guess that if the drain is blocked, and there's rain water around the filler neck, then that water will drop in to the tank when you open the filler cap.  So even if I don't re-attach the blue plastic drain pipe, I must check that the drain from the filler neck is clear.  Don't want water in the tank...


Posted By: 426hemi
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 07:42
I used a piece of welding wire and gently fed it down the breather pipes till it came out the other end.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 08:13
Sounds a good plan, I've got some MIG wire, useful stuff.
 
I'm also wondering if some loops of wire and a cable tie or two might help me change the shape of the Airbox Boot intakes from Oval to round... Smile


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 12:42
Recommended that you do reconnect the drain pipe. A common fault is for the drain pipe that goes through the tank to rupture, allowing fuel to leak through the drain. Better it goes to ground rather than over your bike.

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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 13:41
Good point Stevex.  I guess the drain on the underside of the tank comes out somewhere near the exhaust header on the rear cylinder.  What could possible go wrong...?
 
Thinking about my sticky steering damper, caused by "dry" seals.  Can I just "wet" the seals again by injecting a little fork oil between the damper shaft and the seal?
 
I've made a small tool over lunch to un-do the brass seal retaining rings at each end.  The plan is to hold the steering damper in the vice with one end up.  Unscrew the brass seal retaining ring and put enough fork oil in the end of the damper to cover the seal so it can't draw in any air.  Then wiggle the shaft or tease the gap between the seal and the shaft with a needle to allow some of the oil in.  Put the seal retainer back in and then work the damper back and forth a few times.
 
Yeah, I know I'm a cheapskate. Big smile 


Posted By: wigginsjp
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 17:29
The steering dampers do go off with age. 
They stick and wander if bad enough. Either remove or if you still want it, I had one rebuilt at MCT for £100 

Top post I'm really enjoying seeing your work. Plus I imagine Falco airboxes may evoke the next must have mod 😁


-------------
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2007 V2 1060cc Big Bore
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2004 Race Bike
Kawasaki ZX10R 2007 Race Bike
Aprilia Tuono V4 1100 Factory 2020
www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apworkshops.co.uk


Posted By: wigginsjp
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 17:34
Also ref the tank and swelling. 

Yes they can do and do as described by also check your clip ons aren't bent. Sounds silly but numerous gen1's I've worked on have slightly bent clip ons. You only notice when put next to a straight one but it is there. Particularly the left one seems prone. 

Another thing you can do is Mark aka redrat sells some adjustable lock stops. They will give you marginally less lock if you cant sort the issue. 
Lastly refitting the tank tip. Loosen or remove the rear bolt and fit the fronts first then refit the rear. 

Looked at the lower dog bone and swingarm bearings yet? 


-------------
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2007 V2 1060cc Big Bore
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2004 Race Bike
Kawasaki ZX10R 2007 Race Bike
Aprilia Tuono V4 1100 Factory 2020
www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apworkshops.co.uk


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 19:31
Hi Wigginsjp,

Thanks for the kind words, I'm still at it.

I've only done 50 miles on the bike on a freezing December day, and haven't had to try a U-Turn on it yet. I'd seen the adjustable lock-stops, but was a bit concerned, can I afford to loose any steering lock?

The front of the tank seems to be trapping the headstock dust seal when I tighten it down too, I wonder if I'm missing a spacer or two somewhere.  Might fit a couple of small top hat bushed to just lift the front edge of the tank clear of the dust seal.  Or maybe the tank is just too far forward and that's why it's trapping.  I've taken the two rubber bungs out of the front of the battery box, and that's given me a bit more room to move the tank back and gain a bit at the front of the tank.

I continue to live and learn... I now know that later rider's seats may look the same as early ones from above, but they're different underneath on the front edge.  I'll have to pull the nice not-holey cover off my new seat and fit it to my holey-old seat.  Re-upholstery could be the future.

Front Brake Master Cylinder rebuilt and fitted tonight, with my lovely NOS Brembo Front Brake Lever, a steal at £35 and worth it I think, and a new Brembo Reservoir at £17, not worth it I think, but far better that the blue-anodised capped, rusty bolted, discoloured reservoir that was there.  Nice to have the right bits on yer best brake...  Front callipers to strip and clean before I can get any fluid in there.



I think the cable routing from left and right clip-on switch gear, throttle, fast-idle and clutch is just about sorted, looking tidy and no restrictions.

Steering damper "repair" attempted and failed.  It's better re-lubricated than it was, but still sticky, and probably not good enough.  It still sticks if left for a few minutes.  I'll go and see "reactive Suspension" and see if Gareth can pop a couple of seals and some new oil in it, already done the rose joints and cleaned it up.


Posted By: badapple
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 19:51
Getting there nicely I'm also enjoying the thread. You will continue to learn every time you work on it. This forum has given me the confidence to tackle any job now whereas before anything other than basic services the bike would of gone to a workshop.  You must have a very understanding missus with the amount of cave time you seem to be getting I generally work on my bikes in the daytime when no one us about Big smile

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I started out with nothing and I've still got most of it left


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 22:04
I try and do an hour or so when I get home on a night.  She can watch the soaps while I play in the workshop.  I want the bike done in the next couple of weeks or so, so that I can get some miles on it and be comfortable about taking it to the island for a week in June.

The more I work on it, the more I like it.  I wasn't looking for an RSV, but I've got one, and I'm enjoying it. 😊


Posted By: badapple
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2019 at 22:07
Best way mate stuff TV its all crap I'd rather be riding or tinkering.  Ape bug bites hard im afraid,  I had always wanted one.  Now I've had threeBig smile

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I started out with nothing and I've still got most of it left


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 22 Mar 2019 at 08:12
Strange how things work out isn't it?         I never wanted one at all......and now I have two Smile


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www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: badapple
Date Posted: 22 Mar 2019 at 21:12
Originally posted by IanG IanG wrote:

Strange how things work out isn't it?         I never wanted one at all......and now I have two Smile
Hahaha we've all been bitten 

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I started out with nothing and I've still got most of it left


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 23 Mar 2019 at 12:30
Up early this morning so did a bit before we went in to town.

Wiring to rear lights re-terminated, the hole that PO had drilled in rear tail light surround for alarm LED blank grommeted, new bulbs fitted, and everything cleaned up.  Tail unit and under tray back on, one of the fasteners on the pillion seat cover is broken off, but I think it'll be OK.



In other news, I've laced a short length of stainless MIG wire across the long side of the oval openings of my airbox boots, they're now rounder, larger than the openings in the frame, and line up better than they did.

I also stripped the front brake callipers, mucky 'orrible job.  The pistons and seals all look to be in good order.



So just the calliper castings to clean up, put it all back together, fasten 'em on and bleed.


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 23 Mar 2019 at 12:33
Looking really good there Clap    I do like a project coming good


-------------
www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 23 Mar 2019 at 12:44
Thanks, but she's still a battle scarred Old Charger, I'm just hoping the attention will give her another lease of life.  Smile

Dropped the Ohlins Steering Damper off at Reactive Suspension yesterday.  Gareth wasn't in, but I've asked him to take a look when he has time.  The seals are a lot less sticky since I eased some oil inside them with a needle, but after ten or fifteen minutes static it was still sticking.  It might be that in use it's fine like that, but let's see how much Gareth wants to swap the seals before I decide what to do.

Oh, I've asked Redratbike if he's got any quick-release seat pins ready to go.

Back to my callipers now...


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 23 Mar 2019 at 18:09
My second-hand Brembo disks cleaned up and fitted (hope they're straight!?), front brake callipers back together and fitted.  They're not properly bled yet, they're resisting my will, but pistons have moved out and settled.  Maybe shoving them back will push the air up and out at the reservoir end...



And I will be dealing with the oil cooler at some point. Embarrassed


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 08:53
Front brakes bled, to the point where they're working anyway.  They're going to take another go to get them right.  Top fairing on, lights, indicators, brake and tail all working.



If I crack on with the rear brake master cylinder I can go for a ride round the block.  If it doesn't weave then either I've fixed the problem, or it was the steering damper.  I'd also like to know the front disks are straight.  And of course see if it's too loud as it is!

If all's well I'll make a start on the back end.  Rear brake calliper looks pretty rough, and I know the rear disk is shot.  I want to strip and check the rear shock linkage, fingers crossed there are no horrors hiding there.  And I want to get the rear shock off, cleaned and checked over.

After that lot there's the fairing panels to have a go at.


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 09:12
You're going to make me feel guilty now, if it's not the steering damper!

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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 09:19
Don't worry Steve. I've changed so much on the front end, and any of these changes could've affected the weave.  So long as it's gone I'll be happy.

I got the grass cut yesterday, but it seems I may be going shopping this morning... Maybe I won't get out for that ride round the block after all. 


Posted By: wigginsjp
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 09:29
leave the damper off is a good way to see if it's the rear linkages causing the weave 

-------------
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2007 V2 1060cc Big Bore
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2004 Race Bike
Kawasaki ZX10R 2007 Race Bike
Aprilia Tuono V4 1100 Factory 2020
www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apworkshops.co.uk


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 10:58
Hi Wigginsjp,

It hadn't occurred to me that the rear suspension might also cause the weave...

As you don't actually need a rear brake, I've just been to the end of the drive and back.  Big smile

Before I have to go shopping...



Front disks are straight, that a relief.  I'll have a ride round the block when I get back later this afternoon, then go through the front end to make sure everything's still tight and correctly adjusted.

It's not too loud either, though that might change when the throttle's more open!


Posted By: wigginsjp
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 11:19
Hi arlurt 

A very enjoyable thread and I'm loving the speed and progress you are making here. 

Ref the weave, it can often be caused by the rear dog bone not moving correctly. Or more the swingarm preventing it as they are the most commonly problematic. Had it on my gen1 and I had been 100% sure it was a sticky steering damper (as it was exactly how you described) until I took it off and I felt like I was in a slow motion tank slapper all the time. I then was told it was the head bearings so I had them replaced at great expense as I hadn't the tools.
I ended up doing the bearings on the dog bone and swingarm and it solved the issue. 

Luckily you are looking at all of that and with all your combined efforts and refresh it will be sorted! 

Top work 




-------------
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2007 V2 1060cc Big Bore
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2004 Race Bike
Kawasaki ZX10R 2007 Race Bike
Aprilia Tuono V4 1100 Factory 2020
www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apworkshops.co.uk


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 12:02
Thanks Wigginsjp.  I'm at the shopping centre, having a coffee and wishing I was working on the bike.  I've always intended to go through the bike end to end, and have seen the horror stories about the rear linkage. Are there problems with the swingarm pivot as well?

As usual I'll post pictures of whatever I find.


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 12:11
Not always,but Luigi was a bit sparing of the grease when these bikes were built Confused

Hopefully his wife was better looked after   Wink



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www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 14:01
Fifteen miles done, with no rear brake Embarrassed, and all's well!

No weave at any speed, so I guess it's not been caused by the rear linkage, steering damper still the likely suspect.

It feels very smooth with the FR200, modded collector, open can and airbox tweaks, maybe not quite as happy at very low (quiet) revs in traffic, but that's not a problem. Not as loud as I'd feared from some of the comments on here, I think I can get away with it so long as I show a little restraint when the boys in blue are close by.

I've backed it in the the workshop ready for the rear end investigation.  Does it have a grease nipple on the swing arm pivot?

I'll drop the shock and linkage and see how the swing arm feels with no load on it.

It's been a good day.  Even the tank seems to have settled down a bit, the top yoke now sliding over the top of the tank leading edge.

I guess the other thing to say is that there's nothing to say about starting problems.  It spins over like a good un, no doubt at all it'll fire up every time.  Thanks Johnboy for an excellent fix, so good you almost forget about it as soon as you've done it.


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 14:36
Looking good

No grease nipple as standard but a few have modded theirs to include them,I was going to but expediency got in the way

You do get piece of mind with a set of John's cables and a decent battery,every bike should have them.

And also a decent stand and one of Mark's collectors,airbox mods like the open versions I'm not convinced by,I think people are mistaking noise for power in a lot of cases Wink

Early airboots and Edwards tubes are I think of benefit though


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www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 16:26
OK, the back end is out, rear suspension linkage and shock on the bench.

The good news is that it came apart easily, and the rear brake pads are almost new!



The not so good news...  



The rear shock is leaking.  The shock bottom bush spacers are breaking up, corrosion I think, they're just crumbling.  The lower suspension adjuster is seized.  There's a bit of a knock in all the needle rollers, not too bad, and one of them is rust-marked at one end.

I'd guess someone's been in to it all for the last MoT, stripped, re-greased and cleaned up, and then stuck it all back together.  The needle rollers will stand a bit more grease, and maybe working the grease in will free up the rollers a bit and disguise the knocks.  I think the rollers aren't rolling, just staying put and sliding on the surface of the pins.

Everything moves freely freely enough, and I think the swing-arm bushes seem OK.

My (car) spring compressors are too chunky to be able to remove the spring, So I can't tell yet if there's any damping in the shock.  Maybe I can lash something up to remove the spring, but it's a dodgy thing to work on with improvised tools, there's a lot of potential energy in a compressed spring.  The sensible approach is to make it another job for Reactive Suspension, for which there'll be yet another bill.  There is a second hand Gen 2 Ohlins damper on eBay, are they the same as the Gen 1s?

So I guess I need some of these plastic spacers for the linkage...?

Why do you guys change the linkage side plates, is there something I need to know...?

Think I'll go for a beer or two and drown my sorrows.  Cry


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 17:06
On the Gen 1's there is no need to change side plates unless you're trying to change the ride height dramatically.

The Gen 2,especially the R's with the Ohlins shock have the cut out offset and they have a very weak rear profile which has been known to fail if the bearings seize slightly so people got worried and some went to aftermarket or solid plates just in case.


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www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day


Posted By: Stevex
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 17:32
I took my swing arm out last winter and I'm glad I did, just caught the bearings in time, virtually no grease in them. The dog bone needle rollers aren't captive so you can remove them all to give the whole bearing a good clean...just make sure you don't loose any and count them!
If you decide to remove the swinger you'll need a special castellated  socket to loosen off the right hand side of the axle. Refitting the axle has a 3 torque setting procedure to fit correctly.


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People say I don't know Jack Sh1t; but I do, he lives next door.


Posted By: 426hemi
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 18:10
You only really change the side plates if there gouged or badly corroded or de laminating, whilst the linkage is out I would personally change all the bearings.


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 20:44
Thanks everyone. I'd sort of decided to take out the needles, one bearing at a time, clean up the needles and the bearing outer sleeves, and put 'em back together with loads of fresh grease. I think the inner steel bushes are recoverable.

Maybe you're right about the swing arm bearings... While it's pulled down this far it isn't much more work to have a look at those bearings too. 

What's the favoured grease for the needles and swingarm...?  I've got some Castrol MS3 Lithium, nice stuff...

Do I need some of these plastic parts to keep all that lovely grease in, or will some O rings do the same thing?

Pleased to hear my side plates are OK.  But I think the shock bottom bush is shot. I'm used to rose joints top and bottom, but the Ohlins shock seems to use something different. 


Posted By: 426hemi
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2019 at 00:16
You can buy the bushes, companies like Kais can supply them as for grease I use acf50 grease from demon Tweeks.
https://www.demon-tweeks.com/uk/corrosion-block-acf-50-grease-264791/" rel="nofollow - https://www.demon-tweeks.com/uk/corrosion-block-acf-50-grease-264791/


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2019 at 07:06
Aprilia Performance do a kit that includes the six bearings, three sleeve bushes and six seals at just under £90.  One end of one of my sleeve bushes is showing signs of water damage, rest all look OK.  I'll strip and clean them all and hope to just put it all back together.
 
I've ordered a swing arm nut tool this morning, as while it's pulled down this far I may as well have a look at the swing arm bearings too.  It moves easily, no sign of wear or water damage, but maybe mine's close to becoming a problem too.
 
At the moment the bike is on my Abba stand, how do I hold it up while I take the swing arm out...


Posted By: 426hemi
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2019 at 07:21
If you have a beam in your garage a strap through the subframe works or turn the folding pegs upside down and put axle stands under them.


Posted By: wigginsjp
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2019 at 09:49
Originally posted by arlurt arlurt wrote:

Aprilia Performance do a kit that includes the six bearings, three sleeve bushes and six seals at just under £90.  One end of one of my sleeve bushes is showing signs of water damage, rest all look OK.  I'll strip and clean them all and hope to just put it all back together.
 
I've ordered a swing arm nut tool this morning, as while it's pulled down this far I may as well have a look at the swing arm bearings too.  It moves easily, no sign of wear or water damage, but maybe mine's close to becoming a problem too.
 
At the moment the bike is on my Abba stand, how do I hold it up while I take the swing arm out...

Get the abba stand adapters that use the rear sets bolt holes so you can remove the swingarm. Yes you will need to refit the wheel etc to do this now but it's only a few minutes work. Adapter set is about £20 by memory 


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Aprilia RSVR Factory 2007 V2 1060cc Big Bore
Aprilia RSVR Factory 2004 Race Bike
Kawasaki ZX10R 2007 Race Bike
Aprilia Tuono V4 1100 Factory 2020
www.apriliaperformance.co.uk
www.apworkshops.co.uk


Posted By: arlurt
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2019 at 10:28
Thanks all.  I like the upside-down foot rest idea, very innovative.  I'll have a look at the Abba stand tonight and see what I can come up with using foot rest hanger mounts or meaty bolt holes on the frame.  I might be able to make some Abba stand adapters myself.


Posted By: IanG
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2019 at 10:58
I like your way of working Clap


-------------
www.apworkshops.co.uk
www.apriliaforum.co.uk
www.apriliaownersclub.co.uk

Looking forward to the next track day



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